Okay, does anyone else think Landen is particularly annoying? I can't even believe he would do that to Thursday's brother. Anton made a simple mistake, and so did Landen by making that stupid comment to Thursday after theor particularly wonderful night out seeing Richard III at the Ritz Theater. He also made a mistake even thinking that Thursday could EVER forgive him for his betrayal of Anton. I was so mad at him when he said that, I could've jumped right into the book and strangled him. That would, or course, throw off a good portion of the story's plot, therefore destroying a remarkable book, which by no means deserves to be destroyed.

Sometimes people say the wrong things at the wrong time....

And even though they're very sorry, the harm is done.... I'm glad she managed to understand :)

I think Landen said the right thing. If everyone lies to cover their friends arses then you can't hold out any hope of finding the truth. Landen stuck by his principles, and good for him. At least he can be angry with Anton being scape-goated knowing that it was a tiny part of the whole cock-up, rather than descending to the same level as the people who were really to blame.

Problem is, Thursday also likes to stick to her guns...



PSD

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This is the work of an Italian narco-anarchic collective. Don't bother insulting them, they can't read English anyway.

Kyra _ Wwelcome to the Fforum.

I agree with PSD on this matter.

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"This was willed where what is willed sfcgfggrohjhrhyfgtgg."



Post Edited (06-25-03 09:44)

Hmmm apparently I'm confusing the bits you were refering to...

Because I do think you have to follow what you know/feel it's right.


Memo: re-read TEA....

I agree with you Kyra. When I first read TEA I got enraged by Landen's attitude too. Even though I've re-read it several times and have got a handle on Landen's view of what happened and how he felt a responsibility, it still grates.

You can stand by your friends or you can serve the truth, you can't do both without losing one of them.



Post Edited (06-25-03 10:30)

THANK YOU! I'm glad you feel the same! Now I know that someone feels the same. In response to the other comments, i do agree that Landen was sort of right in telling the truth, so I'll give you that.

Happy to oblige, Kyra!
I think I must've been waiting to get that off my chest :-)

Don't get me wrong, it pisses me off mightily that he won't apologise for having done it, but I have a load of respect for what he said to the investigation.



PSD

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This is the work of an Italian narco-anarchic collective. Don't bother insulting them, they can't read English anyway.

I'm with PSD - well in thought anyway.

Bearing in mind that this is the world of fiction we're dealing with: having a character with the courage of their convictions comes across as something worthy of praise. But, I can't admire Landen for his motivations in wishing to be truthful as he sees it. Absolute truth in everyday life is something unusual enough and truth in war is rare coinage indeed. I have a problem with Landen being cast as this stand-up guy when he is prepared to make statements about Anton's judgement with hindsight. A close friendship is a biased situation, so why would you stand ethically in judgement of a friend who had died making a mistake?

Putting myself into that situation I'd like to think that I'd do the same thing as Landen, although I'd have been a sight more tactful to Thursday. If you lie to the inquiry, then how on earth could you avoid feeling guilty? ~Landen would still know that Anton fouled up, and would have another layer of guilt on top of that. And then what if the mistake was repeated by somebody else in another charge? You'd feel as guilty as hell. Truth is subjective, but you can't find a truth without objective facts. Anton pointing up the wrong valley is an objective fact.

Re-reading the argument, Thursday seems to have mixed her anger at Anton being blamed with her anger at the generals who ran the whole bloody war. She feels like they should be blamed, and indeed they should be, but thinks that they are hiding behind the scape-goating of her brother.



PSD

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This is the work of an Italian narco-anarchic collective. Don't bother insulting them, they can't read English anyway.

Yes indeed, you'd be handling a certain guilt from knowing a beloved friend had made a horrible and tragic mistake. Again a but, as a commanding officer you would be aware that HQ would not hesitate to cover there own backs and sacrifice a friend and brave soldier for their own political devices. Do you still stand on a principle to highlight that at the cost of your friend's mistake and his life? And as you say, his treatment of Thursday alone is less than tactful. What of the family that has to carry the burden of having their son alone carry the burden of a slaughter. The truth may be necessary but it has the capacity to be cruel and merciless on a family who has no defence in the face of it and a man who can not attempt his own justification.

All I can say is that Landen had the privilege of his burden, it was up to him to decide whether he would feel better in himself, or to try and make things better for a dead comrade and his family.

Denial doesn't make anything better though, it just means it gets hidden - and that isn't good for anyone.



PSD

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This is the work of an Italian narco-anarchic collective. Don't bother insulting them, they can't read English anyway.

this always reminded me of the charge of the light brigade and the guy who led the wrong way (not my area of history though) wasn't he seen going the wrong way? but no one really knows because everyone died

My real feelings on it have been he could have been saying to someone 'don't go that way, just look at what the enemy are doing there' I guess we'll have to wait and see if we get any more enlightenment on this in later books. I just react this way every time I read it, that he had a good reason for what he did, and didn't let them down.

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Sylvester says.... *plock*




actually he says peep, cheep, chirrup, squalk,muttermuttergrumblegrumble, oh and now he falls off his pirch whish is followed by a sheepish peek round to see if anyone was looking and a quick scramble back up

Leave Landen alone - he's an alright chap. Isn't it bad enough he was erradicated?

waaaaaaaaaaaaah!

Sorry that my first post has to be in the form of a wail. But is there not a
* No Spoiler* code of ethics on this forum? please pretty please.

I'm a total newbie to Fforde -- just read TEA for the first time - and so I'm being careful not to read the other topics until I've read the next book.

so... "erradicated"?? i didn't see that, Auntysassy!

cheers all. i promise not to gripe so in future messages.
so far this place is GREAT!



Post Edited (07-07-03 04:29)

Hello and welcome to the Fforum! It's interesting and bizarre and you'll never be bored here, I can't speak for the sanity levels though ;-)

Yes, mostly spoilers are avoided or labelled as such. The occasional slip does happen in the thrill of posting but we try to be good, honest! Don't worry about Landen though you'll have lots of fun in finding out in LIAGB :)

Have fun and enjoy!

thanks for the reassurance, belochka. And anyway I forgot that
I guess anythng is reversible in Thursday's world. so, I wont fret.
and oh yeah -- great, another addictive forum. just what I need. sigh...

Ooh. You got bold. I didn't think you could use markers now ??

We should keep it quiet from PSD.