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bloophole (spoilers)
Posted by: FfordeFfan (
Date: July 15, 2005 07:23PM

St. Zvlkx's shouldn't have won that bet. He said that Goliath would fall, but they didn't until after he cashed in his bet.

Re: bloophole (spoilers)
Posted by: Anonymous User (195.10.15.---)
Date: July 18, 2005 02:44PM

You can cash in an accumulator on a percentage of the current worth normally.

Re: bloophole (spoilers)
Posted by: Puck (
Date: November 10, 2005 08:33PM was a self-referential bet. Essentially, Zvlkx bet that he would win.

That reminds me of a logic joke (which I will tentatively credit to Martin Gardner - edit: it was Raymond Smullyan in his book Alice in Puzzleland) that uses characters from Alice Through the Looking Glass:

(The tail end of a long string of riddles)
Red Queen: Here is your last question: Will you get this question right?
Alice:(thinks about it)... Yes?
Red Queen: Wrong.

In that case, the Red Queen could have called it either right or wrong, but I doubt that could have worked for Goliath as they would have had their lawyers search the thing for loopholes. I don't think Zvlkx actually bet on Goliath's fall, the odds were on the outcome of the Superhoop; Goliath's fall was a direct result of Swindon winning, not a probability, and Zvlkx was just being cheeky to write it on the betting slip. That's my best guess, anyway!

Metaphors be with you!

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/04/2007 01:57AM by Puck.

Re: bloophole (spoilers)
Posted by: robert (
Date: November 10, 2005 09:13PM

To be a proper conundrum, shouldn't either:

a) the Queen's question be "Will you get this answer wrong " (which ever way Alice answers, she is right), or

b) Alice's answer to the original wording be "No" (once again, the answer is always correct)

Re: bloophole (spoilers)
Posted by: Puck (
Date: November 10, 2005 10:25PM

robert wrote:

> b) [Shouldn't] Alice's answer to the original wording be "No" (once again,
> the answer is always correct)

If she answered "No," her answer would not be correct, it would be a paradox:
The Red Queen could not say that "No" was correct, because then Alice would be wrong about not getting the question right, in which case her answer would actually be incorrect, in which case... etc.
Likewise, the Queen could not say that Alice was wrong because then Alice would be right about being wrong... etc.
Infinite regress.

The same thing would happen if Alice answered "Yes" to the question "Will you get this answer wrong?" If, however, she answered "No" to that question it would be no different from answering "Yes" to the original question.

Post Edited (11-10-05 23:28)

Metaphors be with you!

Re: bloophole (spoilers)
Posted by: Anonymous User (
Date: July 13, 2006 03:56PM

To the origin of the thread.

The Saint did not cash his ticket, having been struck by a #23 bus. The ticket fell to Joffee, and the timing of its redemption is unclear.

We do what we must

'The point is.... that its pointless.'

Re: bloophole (spoilers)
Posted by: MuseSusan (
Date: July 13, 2006 05:31PM

But I think we're all glad for the collapse of Goliath, even if Saint Zvlkx did smell bad.

Welcome, T&J (do you mind if I call you T&J?) We're a little more active over at the Nextian Chat section of the fforum, and if you come over and introduce yourself, they may offer you cake!

Re: bloophole (spoilers)
Posted by: Lymond (
Date: December 29, 2006 11:23PM

The timing of the cashing in must have been after the superhoop win as that was the bet with the big odds, the others were (relatively) small odds. 420/1 i think was the odds on the battle of waterloo. The superhoop game was 124000/1 and because it was an accumulator bet that last odds would have made it worth the 128 billion pounds. Also the fall of goliath,i thought, was irrelivant to the bet as the bet was on swindon winning the superhoop not on goliath falling. The goliath part was only relevant in the prophecy part.

Re: bloophole (spoilers)
Posted by: MuseSusan (
Date: December 30, 2006 06:48PM

I thought the prophecy was the bet.

Re: bloophole (spoilers)
Posted by: Puck (
Date: January 04, 2007 01:59AM

It was. The items on the betting slip were stated in elaborate archaic fashion, so those who didn't know what it was took them to be prophesies.

Metaphors be with you!

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